VOICE - General Meeting for 2004-03-20
12:05:57 <WalterOS2> This meeting of VOICE is now in session.
<WalterOS2> We have a lot to do today.
<WalterOS2> Even you have already viewed the Agenda, you should check it again. I added a couple of items this morning. :-)
<WalterOS2> As a remember, it's at http://www.os2voice.org/Agendas/voice_2004-03-20.html
<WalterOS2> er..reminder. :-)
<WalterOS2> OK, let's get on with the agenda.
<WalterOS2> Item A Old Business
<eCSNL> I think I already delt with that point last week
<WalterOS2> 1. Spanish Translation of VNL.
<eCSNL> unless you have new info
<eCSNL> Walter
<WalterOS2> Sorry, Roderick. :-(
<WalterOS2> The last couple of weeks have been crazy, and I've not a chance to read the log. :-(
<WalterOS2> Could you give us a thumbnail sketch of what happened at the last meeting, please.?
<WalterOS2> I'm sorry to dump this on you now. :-(
<WalterOS2> Specifically, what happened with the Spanish translation?
<WalterOS2> Hi Gord
<Gord> Hi
<eCSNL> Well basicly
<eCSNL> I talked to Christiaan
<eCSNL> and either
<eCSNL> you or Christiaan
<eCSNL> was still waiting for an email back
<eCSNL> from one of the spanish volenteers
<eCSNL> a yes
<eCSNL> it was Christiaan.
<eCSNL> That is the status
<WalterOS2> That's pretty much what I understood.
<eCSNL> The contact with the Spanish volenteer
<eCSNL> does not seem to being going smooth
<eCSNL> from his side
<eCSNL> for a reason unknown to me...
<WalterOS2> As you can see from the agenda, I figured it was dead.
<WalterOS2> What about subpara. 2: The speakup?
<WalterOS2> heh
<eCSNL> Wel I have not asked Bob for a speakup
<eCSNL> simply because its not usefull at this moment.
<eCSNL> The reason being that
<eCSNL> we are making the final plans for the eCS stuff
<eCSNL> I know what that stuff is
<eCSNL> and I feel its not usefull doing a speak up.
<eCSNL> So what do I have a replacement ?
<eCSNL> A speakup with John Gow
<eCSNL> author of the DTA
<eCSNL> (for details see home.wanadoo.nl/rwklein )
<WalterOS2> What is DTA?
<eCSNL> Data Transport Agent...
<eCSNL> Its part of the refurbish program
<eCSNL> for MMOS/2
<eCSNL> Its a system that process audio buffers
<WalterOS2> Well, I went to your site, and didn't see anything about that. Maybe I wasn't looking in the right place. :-)
<WalterOS2> Anyway, that does sound interesting. Have you arranged a time?
<WalterOS2> \date ?
<eCSNL> I was just giving him a phone call
<eCSNL> I have had some very busy weeks
<eCSNL> and I just become a bit wiser
<eCSNL> and a year older :-)
<WalterOS2> :-)
<WalterOS2> Probably, the VOICE meeting on Apr 15 would be good.
<WalterOS2> Busy weeks...ah but you're about 1/3 of my age. <g>
<WalterOS2> OK, Roderick, keep us informed.
<WalterOS2> B. New Business
<WalterOS2> 1. Status of Russian version of VNL.
<eCSNL> You need to check
<eCSNL> the logs on that from two weeks
<eCSNL> ago
<eCSNL> can't remeber
<eCSNL> what I found out
<eCSNL> from Christiaan
<WalterOS2> I've had two volunteers, who seem quite excited about it.
<WalterOS2> Christian and I have working together on this, so I pretty much know what he knows. :-)
<WalterOS2> been working
<WalterOS2> Christian feels that we need at 3 or 4 (i.e 1 or 2 more) before can start the project.
<WalterOS2> Roderick: Can you think of someone willing and able to help us?
<eCSNL> uHUU
<WalterOS2> Obviously they need to be reasonably fluent in Russian and English.
<eCSNL> For Russian ?
<eCSNL> Hmmm
<WalterOS2> Yep.
<eCSNL> I'm Dutch
<eCSNL> :-)
<eCSNL> Not Russian
<eCSNL> Sorry I don't know many Russians
<eCSNL> and the people I do not
<eCSNL> sadly have already fully booked agenda's
<WalterOS2> But you're a lot closer to the Russians (geographically) than I am. :-)
<eCSNL> and rest of there time is spent sleeping :-)
<eCSNL> Depends on how you look at it
<eCSNL> You are closer to Vladivostok then I'm maybe :-)
<WalterOS2> Canada is 4500 miles long, and I'm near the Eastern part of it. <g>
<WalterOS2> Let me check something...
<eCSNL> We are getting on off topic Mr Chairman
<WalterOS2> The topic is a Russian version of the VNL.
<WalterOS2> I've posted message on VOICE NE
<WalterOS2> WS, ecomstation.ru, and os2world.com
<WalterOS2> Anything you can think of that I left out?
<WalterOS2> OK, let's move on....
<WalterOS2> 2. Treasurer's Report (Gord)
<WalterOS2> Gord, the floor is yours....
<Gord> Sorry, TTW just came home from work.
<Gord> Balance of account is [ --- ] CDN
<Gord> Account in Kitimat is still open.
<Gord> I was planning to leave it open until I had received one deposit each from BMT and Mensys.
<Gord> Have not received account of Kitimat's transactions and have ot pursued it.
<WalterOS2> Isn't it nice to actually have Treasurer's Reports again?
<Gord> No deposits have been made to the account as of last Statement 15 Mar.
<Gord> Have Mensys and BMT got my new address?
<WalterOS2> TO or Kitimat?
<WalterOS2> Gord: Yes.
<Gord> Toronto account.
<WalterOS2> WHOA! Your new address?
<WalterOS2> Have you moved?
<Gord> Still awaiting deposit from Mensys
<eCSNL> I spoke with you about that on the phone...
<Gord> Our membership form on BMT should be amended to include a system generated date.
<Gord> End of report.
<WalterOS2> Gord: Could you elaborate on what you and Roderick said?
<WalterOS2> We can omit from the log, if appropriate.
<Gord> Maybe Roderick would elaborate.
<WalterOS2> Roderick:
<eCSNL> Well Voice MAY be getting more then the about 150 Euro's
<eCSNL> The reason being that
<eCSNL> the amount of paid money goes back to 2001
<eCSNL> That is UNPAID money
<Gord> Walter, No have not moved. Sorry.
<eCSNL> The reason its not that easy to trace is because all bank and credit card tranactions at Mensys are done electronic
<eCSNL> including electronic bank transactions...
<eCSNL> However VOICE payments where done by cheque
<WalterOS2> Gord: Then BMT and Mensys both have it. I've gotten confirmation messages from both of them.
<eCSNL> We need to do some digging to find out when the last paument was done....
<eCSNL> The last trace I can find of the payment was June 2001
<eCSNL> Now I just can NOT believe that was the last date of payment!
<Gord> Walter, Good.
<eCSNL> Its no comment on the US/Canadian bank system
<WalterOS2> Well, please really thank Mensys (or you <g>) for going to all this work!
<eCSNL> its just in the Netherlands cheque's have died out about 5 to 10 years ago I think...
<eCSNL> Since then cheque payments have more or less died out
<WalterOS2> Not many people use cheques here either.
<WalterOS2> As far as the US banks go, Thomas of BMT said their banking system was really behind the times, and that to setup the same electronic account we have in TO, would cost about (if I understand him right) $50 US /per month in transaction fees.
<WalterOS2> :-(
<WalterOS2> Gord, have you gotten a transaction history from the bank, yet?
<Gord> No, and I haven't pursued it either.
<WalterOS2> Why?
<WalterOS2> :-)
<WalterOS2> You've asked them for one, right?
<Gord> I'm trying to save my year in college. Been studying at school in the afternoons to pass the course .
<Gord> I did ask for one.
<WalterOS2> Understood. :-)
<WalterOS2> OK, that's fine. :-)
<Gord> I also ordered a book of cheques which have arrived.
<WalterOS2> Gord, I emailed you about getting the transaction date added to our BMT form.
<WalterOS2> Good. :-)
<Gord> Yes. I sent you a reply several hours ago.
<WalterOS2> That's strange: I don't have it yet.
<WalterOS2> Some of my mail list postings don't get sent to me either.
<WalterOS2> Must have a chat with my ISP.
<Gord> I have also cleaned up all but one of the outstanding emails of people who joined.
<WalterOS2> That's terrific!
<Gord> Next step is to go through the database and email those whose membership has recently, or is about to, expire
<Gord> My reply went throught the VOICE server.
<WalterOS2> As you said to me in an email, it's a good thing you didn't know how much work was involved when you agreed to be Acting Treasurer. :-)
<Gord> The one that is not done is the one from Christian wanting a paper receipt for several people.
<WalterOS2> Unfortunately, none of us did. :-(
<Gord> I don't feel right about issuing that until I have some records.
<WalterOS2> That makes sense.
<Gord> Must buy a receipt book, too.
<WalterOS2> OK, but take of your schooling first. :-)
<WalterOS2> er..take care of
<Gord> OK
<WalterOS2> Thanks.
<WalterOS2> Anyone have any questions relating to the Treasurer's Report and the discussion?
<Zoltan> I have not been around for a long time, what happened to Peter?
<Gord> I believe he asked for someone else to take over the duties.
<WalterOS2> Something like that, yes.
<Zoltan> Thanks Gord, Walter.
<WalterOS2> If there's no more discussion, let's move on.
<WalterOS2> Last year VOICE moved that we donate $750 to Warpstock for the 2003 event.
<WalterOS2> Because of the mess at that time with our banking situation, we were never able to write the cheque. :-(
<wdl> Move to honor the pledge, and make the payment.
<WalterOS2> Thanks, Bill
<WalterOS2> Is there a seconder?
<Gord> I second that.
<WalterOS2> Discussion?
<Gord> What was it intended to cover?
<Gord> Is Warpstock after us for it?
<WalterOS2> Absolutely not! They've never mentioned it.
<WalterOS2> However we did make the motion, told Warpstock about it, and now we have the money in a viable bank account.
<WalterOS2> Mark was really pleased when I told him about it.
<WalterOS2> Like Bill, I think it's the honourable thing to do.
<wdl> The new Warpstock - assuming it flies - will need some seed money.
<WalterOS2> Each year VOICE has contributed an amount to help Warpstock with their expenses for the event. We don't designate it for any particular expense.
<Gord> The new WS is the next item on the agenda.
<Gord> OK
<WalterOS2> Gord's right. :-)
<WalterOS2> As I see it, the one were talking about now, is essentially a debt.
<Gord> I agree.
<WalterOS2> Any further discussion?
<WalterOS2> If not, then the chair calls for the vote.
<WalterOS2> The motion is:
<WalterOS2> Honour our previous pledge, and make the payment [of $750 US].
<WalterOS2> All in favour, please type Aye.
<wdl> Aye
<Gord> Aye.
<KenKrchnr> Aye
<eCSNL> Aye
<Zoltan> Aye
<WalterOS2> All opposed, please type Nay.
<WalterOS2> Motion is carried.
<WalterOS2> Gord, I'll get you the address.
| ...three people disappear... |
<WalterOS2> I guess an IRC server just went down somewhere. :-(
| ...three people re-appear... |
<eCSNL> hmmm
<eCSNL> some screwey
<eCSNL> screwy
<KenKrchnr> Hey, where'd you guys all go??? :-)
<eCSNL> Hmm what did I miss
<eCSNL> I gues
<eCSNL> fyrelizard.com
<eCSNL> had a hickup
<WalterOS2> Ken, did you kick the power cord, or something?
<WalterOS2> Or was it someone else?
<WalterOS2> Roderick: Nothing.
<KenKrchnr> Nah, I think it was Sector's server.
<WalterOS2> Because all the signoff messages said...irc.nj.webbnet.org
<WalterOS2> Anyway, welcome back everyone.
<WalterOS2> I'm going to table item B4 until the next meeting.
<wdl> Good idea.
<WalterOS2> I want to spend sometime on Bill's proposed amendments to our by-laws. :-)
<WalterOS2> I've posted them at: http://www.os2voice.org/elections/VoiceBylaws.html for easy access.
<WalterOS2> Please take some time to at least scan through them.
<wdl> Walter: You'll remember what you've seen is incomplete? Meant to show only the direction I'm taking?
<WalterOS2> We'll spend some more time next meeting, but we can at least start now.
<WalterOS2> wdl: I understand.
<WalterOS2> These are not official proposals, just say, working papers. :-)
<WalterOS2> Bill I have one comment right off. Some of your ideas, like two secretaries, are really good in principle, but one of our main struggles in VOICE is getting enough leaders.
| ...three people disappear again... |
<WalterOS2> I think Sector's mad at us.
<WalterOS2> Maybe just me...
<Rat-Salad> that was Ken's server
<Rat-Salad> hi
<Rat-Salad> heh
| ...three people re-appear again... |
<KenKrchnr> Netsplit, I think Sector's server is winking
<WalterOS2> Ken says not.
<Gord> my nick list shows only you and I
<Rat-Salad> it was your server KenKrchnr
<eCSNL> 54
<wdl> Walter: One person may hold two offices, in many cases. Permitted under the Bylaws - I think...
<WalterOS2> Welcome back, everyone.
<Gord> Did the motion to support WS2003 pass?
<WalterOS2> Yes.
<Gord> OK. I will be in touch about how to cut the cheque.
<WalterOS2> I've written one of the Warpstock Board members to get the address and account information where to send the cheque.
<Gord> OK
<wdl> Walter: To repeat for the others - One person may hold two offices in some cases. And a later provision reduces the total # of officers, anyway.
<WalterOS2> wdl: Agreed, but all the leaders we do have are really busy...Just ask Roderick, Gord, or me. :-)
<WalterOS2> Any other comments?
<WalterOS2> wdl: Do you want to take both the positions of recording secretary and correspondence secretary? <VBG>
<wdl> Did everyone see the warning: The presentation is *unfinished* - a guide to the direction I'm taking. Goal not reached yet.
<wdl> Walter: One person could be both Secretaries. When the joint burden gets too large, a mechanism is alreadySecr
<wdl> ...in place for simply splitting the task. No new changes to the Bylaws
<wdl> ...would be required.
<wdl> The two Secretaries only is a conventional way of handling the duties...
<WalterOS2> willing to work on this project.
<wdl> ...of the two present "officers" whose positions would be eliminated.
<WalterOS2> Most/all of the functions you described for the r.c. fall under the job description of the Liasion Officer.
<wdl> Walter: Yes. I propose to eliminate that position - which has overlapping...
<wdl> ...duties with at least two others.
<WalterOS2> Maybe we should dump the L.O. in favour of Secretary, and call the recording secretary the "clerk'.
<WalterOS2> wdl: That makes sense.
<wdl> The naames I propose for the Officers are in world-wide use. "Clerk" as a voting member of the BOD is not.
<wdl> ...but what's in a name...?
<WalterOS2> OK, I see where you're coming from.
<WalterOS2> I've never heard of the two secretaries concept before now. :-)
<wdl> All: What I need/want right now only is a sense that the direction I'm heading...
<wdl> ...is acceptable. More work then follows.
<WalterOS2> OK, people. Let's not pick at nits.
<wdl> Walter: Two Secretaries is pretty common.
<WalterOS2> Anybody want to give Bill input as to the general direction Bill is going?
<wdl> As I'd said before, I pored over a whole bunch of sample and actual Bylaws.
<wdl> The one I'm proposing conforms to almost all.
<WalterOS2> It's obvious you've done a lot of work, and I appreciate it. :-)
<WalterOS2> I'll take your word for it. :-)
<wdl> ...And retains almost all of the original "framers" work and ideas.
<WalterOS2> I'm mainly concerned about the number of people it *may* require.
<wdl> Walter: It will require two *fewer* than now!
<WalterOS2> But we can talk about that later. :-)
<WalterOS2> OK, can you explain that?
<wdl> Walter: From a present 7-member Board, down to only five.
<wdl> It's in gthe current posting.
<wdl> ...I think. ;-)
<Gord>
<WalterOS2> I didn't get time to actually calculate the number of personnel. :-(
<wdl> Hmm. Maybe it goes to six.
<WalterOS2> Keep in mind that we're having trouble finding people to fill our existing positions.
<wdl> Does go down, though.
<WalterOS2> One of my "internal policies" is to try to avoid giving multiple duties to one person. :-)
<wdl> "...existing position" was high on my list of concerns. Partly why I wanted the reduction.
<WalterOS2> I made an exception with Roderick, however.
<WalterOS2> wdl: Good
<WalterOS2> Roderick is currently acting as our unofficial Liaison Officer (sp?). He's having a struggle finding enough time.
<wdl> Helps if/when a real quorum might be required. Easier to get one...
<WalterOS2> I guess.
<WalterOS2> OTOH, I wanted to make the editor-in-chief of the VNL a member of the board ex officio.
<wdl> That's common, too. Often a *NON*-voting member.
<WalterOS2> But he pointed out that he wouldn't be able to attend meetings, so I gave up because he would be another Board Member who wouldn't be attending meetings. :-(
<wdl> That's OK. Privileged to attend, but not required...
<wdl> Meaning *Board* meetings; which can be private/closed.
<Gord> Can you close a meeting held on an IRC channel?
<wdl> ...Private/closed and still legal, that is.
<WalterOS2> That's a good way of looking at it. I would probably want the Warpdoctor co-ordinator <g> to be a member of the board ex officio. It wouldn't make any actual difference now,
<WalterOS2> but it seems to me it would just make sense.
<wdl> Walter: Yes.
<wdl> There is actually method in my madness -- the proposed Bylaw changes. They're not just
<WalterOS2> OK, we're past the closing time for the meeting, and it seems that Gord has a TTW. :-)
<Gord> She's in a good mood at the moment.
<wdl> ...random proposals. Each change has a specific reason --- a goal to meet/reach.
<WalterOS2> We'll continue this discussion at the next meeting.
<wdl> Cool.
<Gord> Move we adjourn.
<wdl> "TTW" - I *wondered* where she'd gotten too. ;-)
<wdl> Second
<WalterOS2> It would be good if you could lay out your overall strategy for us.
<eCSNL> supporting that
<WalterOS2> All in favour of adjourning, please type Aye.
<Gord> I'd like to see it too
<wdl> That was why I wanted input. Next pass will display overall strategy.
<Gord> Aye.
<wdl> Aye
<KenKrchnr> Aye
<WalterOS2> Opposed, please type Nay.
14:07:57 <WalterOS2> Motion is carried. Meeting adjourned.