SpeakUp with Sundial Systems (Topic: Mesa 2) from 04/24/2000

<mandie>	VOICE would like to welcome Randell Flint and Rollin White from Sundial Systems!
<Swanee>	alaskan: Hunting country!!! :-)
<alaskan>	opps...Hi mandie :)
<PeterSkye>	Alaskan - thanks, I know that area
<randell>	As with all of our VOICE speakups, we're going to focus primarily on just one of our products.
<mandie>	We'd also like to thank everyone for joining us tonight
<Projects>	Alaskan must live close to /me
<randell>	Tonight, it's Mesa 2 -- our spreadsheet...
<alaskan>	Projects> you in this area?
<randell>	So, let me start by asking if any of you have any questions about Mesa, what it does, or where we're going with it?
*	Abraxas has a question :-)
<Projects>	alaskan: relatively speaking :) I'm 2 hours southeast of Hyder, Alaska
<randell>	Abraxas?
<SteveS>	I'll bite. Where are you going with Mesa2?
<Abraxas>	I saw this soemwhere on the Internet (so it MUST be true) :-)
<Projects>	hehehe
<Abraxas>	That I can create a simple SPraedsheet in Mesa ... and export it as a Table in HTML
<Abraxas>	Spreadsheet, even
<randell>	Absolutely!
<Abraxas>	Darn fingers aren't working right :-)
<Projects>	he said "absolutely" far too quickly
<alaskan>	abraxas> blame the secretary! ;)
<randell>	Select any area of the spreadsheet, then go File->Export selection, pick HTML and you got it!
<Abraxas>	LOL
<Projects>	damn, I knew it was too easy
<Abraxas>	That is WAy too easy :-)
<randell>	Ok, there are *harder* ways to do it to!
<Abraxas>	NO!!!! .. Thanks .... :-)
<Projects>	so easy that you've been looking for more complex ways to do it
*	ShadwWulf has a question....what database formats(if any) can you export the table to/inport the tables from?
<Timka>	Abraxas: and using REXX in macros you can even put resulted HTML onto WWW/FTP server
<Abraxas>	Easy works for me :-)
<mandie>	Timka: as in auto upload?
<randell>	ShadwWulf, we don't support reading/writing most *database* formats (like DBF) but we do support most common spreadsheet formats
<rollin>	We also support CSV, which most databases can export to.
<ShadwWulf>	ah...ok...kewl
<Timka>	mandie: why not? of course, it's not a very simple task but it's possible
<StevenL>	Rollin, does Text export default to CSV?
<rollin>	StevenL, yes, but you're given lots of choices for delimiting your text.
<SteveS>	If you need to read/write DBF files, you can use DBExpert.
<mandie>	Timka: I've done it with rexx and rxftp
<randell>	Another little known "data transfer" capability of Mesa 2 is to select an area, copy it to the clipboard, and paste it... depending on the target you can get some very good results.
<Timka>	mandie: great!
<mandie>	but not with Mesa :)
<randell>	SteveS, yes, DBExpert is the choice you DBF files... and it will work to transfer stuff between Mesa and DBExpert via the clipboard
<StevenL>	Randell, it would be handy if there was a "Copy Special" to copy CSV to the clipboard.
<Timka>	mandie: but you can adopt your script to use in Mesa 2. I doubt it's difficult
<randell>	StevenL, that would be interesting... what currently goes onto the clipboard is "TSV" -- tab separated values
<StevenL>	Yep, it's nicely formatted, but not so good for post processing.
<randell>	I suppose we could eventually make that delmiter character for the clipboard a "settable" preference
<ShadwWulf>	is there a published export/input filter SDK?
<randell>	StevenL, depends on what's doing the post-processing...
<StevenL>	Either that, or add a Save to Clipboard checkbox to the SaveAs dialog...
<Timka>	ShadwWulf: yes
<ShadwWulf>	Timka: kewl
<maverick>	Randall, any upgrages to Mesa planned for near future and what might it include?
<StevenL>	Randell, the big problem with TSV is if you really need CSV, the conversion is not always automatic.
<randell>	ShadwWulf, it's not currently published but we sometimes make it available on special request. We do intend to make in public relatively soon in the future.
<Swanee>	Hi Iceman!
<ShadwWulf>	randell: kewl...good to hear...8')
<Timka>	ShadwWulf: and SDK to create new functions too
<randell>	Timka, yes...
<randell>	Since the question has now come up twice about "future plans"... let's go there for awhile...
<Iceman>	hi there, i'm a bit late so hope i didn't miss too much...
<mandie>	Iceman: no, we started a bit late :)
<randell>	The short answer is that Version 2.3 is coming quite soon... the planned availability is this June!
<randell>	What's in it?
<Abraxas>	That was MY line :-)
<mandie>	do tell! :)
<Abraxas>	:-)
<randell>	Well, assuming I've copied the URL right (unlike the last time I did this), take a look at...
<randell>	http://www.sundialsystems.com/mesa/mesa23preview.html
<randell>	As you can see, it's not as long a list as some of our upgrades... but it still a significant list of stuff.
<randell>	The "big thing" is a major upgrade of our real-time feed feature...
<randell>	One part of that is the ability for Mesa 2 to automatically keep track of *changes* to a feed value.
<randell>	You can find out the current value, the most recent change, the one before that, etc, as well as when the changes happened!
<randell>	And that can make all the difference when you are trying to graph or analyze changing data values!
<randell>	I won't spend lots of time going over all the new features... or the details of the new feed features... but I'
<randell>	but I'll be happy to answer questions about them...
<maverick>	Haven't checked the list but one nice thing would be...when editing a cell, the rest of the row disappears, rather disconcerting
<mandie>	famous last words! :)
<Projects>	sure... say that, then run off
<PeterSkye>	Randell - do you have online documentation yet on the new real-time data feed ?
<mandie>	the real time feed looks really neat!
<warspite>	Randell: Can you now get a date with slashes in UK (Aust) format..e.g. 25/4/00 or 25/4/2000?
<rollin>	No, the documentation is not online, but is in the PreReleases.
<mandie>	we lost randell..he'll be back
<StevenL>	IRC hint. Wait for Randell to return.
<rollin>	Warpsite, I'm not sure, I'll check on that.
<warspite>	Thank you.
<rollin>	Randell, I wasn't sure on this one:
<rollin>	Randell: Can you now get a date with slashes in UK (Aust)
<rollin>	format..e.g. 25/4/00 or 25/4/2000?
<PeterSkye>	Hi Randell. Do you have online documentation yet on the new real-time data feed?
<randell>	Well, I didn't expect to get kicked off for that!
<rollin>	PEter, you didn't like my answer?
<Projects>	hahaha
<randell>	Peter, yes... do you want details?
<PeterSkye>	Rollin - what answer?
<PeterSkye>	Randell - yes, please. That's something I'd like to read.
<randell>	warpsite, yes, you should be able to... and it's got a new module for recognizing dates better as well
<randell>	Peter, it's not available on-line at this time; it's included in the new version.
<PeterSkye>	Randell - ok, how much and how do I order ...
<StevenL>	Rollin, isn't the prerelease online?
<warspite>	Thank you, Randell, that'll help alot.
<randell>	I can send you the new docs later if you really want an early look at them.
<Iceman>	was it the SCOUG that recently had a workshop on using scripting & rexx for mesa, would it be available somewhere to learn from?
<rollin>	StevenL, only for a limited number of testers, it's not public.
<Timka>	warpsite: yes you can - i have just tried that in format mm/dd/yy - works fine
<madodel>	Regarding saving in Excel format. Anyway you can have a warning pop up when the limit is reached? That bit me a few weeks ago when I had to create a file for a windoze only client.
<PeterSkye>	Randell - yes, I _would_ like to read the docs.
<rollin>	ICeman, we're in the middle of doing a series of meetings on Mesa scripting. Peaces of it are online. Soon we'll have it all online. Also, I'll be giving Warptech presentations on the topic.
<warspite>	Ahh Timka: Unfortunately, we work in DD/MM/YY
<Iceman>	rollin, online on the sundial site?
<randell>	Timka, I'm not sure which limit you are referring to. If it's the 7Meg limit on Excel 97 export, that's been entirely removed in the new version.
<PeterSkye>	Randell - I need to create an online monitoring graph that updates continually and ...
<rollin>	Iceman, Sundial or SCOUG. Soon both.
<PeterSkye>	... shows the status of all the downloads I continuously run. That will show me when ...
<madodel>	randell: That's great news
<PeterSkye>	... a download gets into trouble. I can do that with the real-time data feed, yes ?
<Timka>	warspite: dd/mm/yy works too
<warspite>	Great!
<maverick>	Randell, when editing a cell, the entire row disappears until you hit ENTER. Can this be changed?
<Iceman>	speaking of excel, the ONE thing that mesa 2 is lacking is a solver, it this something being worked on for 2.3?
<randell>	Peter, yes... and that all sounds to me like stuff you can do in the current version... I don't think you need the time dimension or the other new features
<PeterSkye>	Randell - thanks. :)
<randell>	maverick, that's a feature, not a bug... seriously, let me explain.
<randell>	maverick, historically, Mesa 2 worked the other way... but people got tried of not being able to read *long* formulas then might be entering in a cell...
<randell>	so, that became an option beginning with 2.2. You can turn *off* the option...
<randell>	by opening the Preferences manager, flipping the page, and checking "small in-cell editing" I believe
<maverick>	Thanks, Randell, all my formulas are short :)
<warspite>	Randell, I'm still having problems with my Boxes and Lines
<randell>	I have to admit, that particular feature drove me nuts as well when we first starting testing it for 2.2
<randell>	warspite, please explain...
<warspite>	it's something that's not a worry at the moment but......
<warspite>	will it be looked at in the future?
<warspite>	I can put boxes and lines on my ss, but they won't print or export...
<Timka>	warspite: ???
<randell>	That's not an issue I'm familiar with... (Dan would know for sure if he were here)...
<randell>	If I recall correctly, they should be printable but may or may not be exportable depending on your export format.
<randell>	Have you send the details of this to support?
<warspite>	He did send me a solution, but it didn't work (for me). It's probably me.
<warspite>	Yes, Daniel knows about it.
<randell>	Hummm...
<randell>	Feel free to drop me a copy directly (randell@sundialsystems.com) and we'll look into it further and try to figure out why it's not working for you.
<warspite>	Don't worry...it's not a real hangup at the moment.
<warspite>	OK, Randell, and thanks again.
<randell>	But I don't like things like that hanging out in space...
<randell>	Other questions on the new features in 2.3... or about the existing version?
<warspite>	I'll send the ss, once I'm away from here.
<PeterSkye>	I have a question about documentation.
<randell>	warpspite, thank you.
<PeterSkye>	Is there a way to set up a "custom" INF/HLP file into which I can put ...
<randell>	Oh, not a Peter documentation question...
<PeterSkye>	... all the information I learn from Dan Kulp or on my own?
<PeterSkye>	If it's two or three months between the time I start a project and the time ..
<PeterSkye>	... I "get back to it to finish it", I forget most of the help you guys have given me ...
<Timka>	randell: will Mesa file format change?
<PeterSkye>	... and I have to ask the questions a second time.
*	SteveS says all Peter wants is documentation and then never reads most of it.
<randell>	I guess I don't quite understand... but, no, there is no way to add your own comments/annotations to the help file...
<randell>	You can, however, add comments to any cell in any sheet.
<PeterSkye>	SteveS: Hey! My Duck is gonna come bite you on the ankle.
<StevenL>	Peter, you can create your own .INF file and link from it to the Mesa manual.
<randell>	Timka, the Version 2.3 file format is the same as the 2.2 format.
<rollin>	One can create their own .INF, but it's not clear if Peter can :)
<PeterSkye>	Randell - seriously, how should I manage documentation that isn't supplied with Mesa 2?
<maverick>	I have a separate *.txt file for all my apps w/my notes in them.
<rollin>	Peter, how about HTML?
<StevenL>	Of course that means you have to read the IPF manual.
<PeterSkye>	Rollin - OH GOOD! A topic for the _next_ Mesa 2 class ! :))
<randell>	Peter, exactly the same as you manage (or don't manage) the documentation that comes (or doesn't come) with any program.
<PeterSkye>	StevenL - so where's the IPF file?
<StevenL>	You own it...
<madodel>	Or get text2inf or some such
<StevenL>	I can with VA PL/1.
<Timka>	randell: another question - can i use old SDK to create own import/export filters and new functions with new version?
<PeterSkye>	StevenL - I own a _lot_ of stuff. That doesn't mean I can ever find what I need.
<Iceman>	randall, will 2.3 have the add-in kit for linking to external programs?
<madodel>	Home Page Publisher will generate IPF from HTML
<randell>	Timka, since we've never officially published the old SDK, that's a little hard for me to answer....
<Timka>	randell: ok
<PeterSkye>	Mark - (and thanks for the DHCP info at *.tcpip) - text2inf will create a file ?
<randell>	but I belive the answer is yes -- thought you might need a revised SDK for some things.
<randell>	Peter, I'm still missing your point... what do you want to *do* with the documentation?
<StevenL>	He want's to lose it, if history is any barometer.
<rollin>	He wants a data repository to use with Mesa. His problem is not exclusive to Mesa.
<PeterSkye>	Randell - I want to have additional documentation that I create.
<PeterSkye>	Rollin - that's correct.
<randell>	Ok...
<PeterSkye>	Mark - TEXT2INF isn't on Hobbes, I just searched.
<randell>	What form do you want it in and, most importantly, how do you want to access it?
<madodel>	PeterSkye: I have never used it. It may just create IPF code. you then need the IPFC.EXE to compile it to INF
<madodel>	PeterSkye: maybe it's text2ipf
<PeterSkye>	If I set a project aside for three or four weeks, I _don't_ remember all the little tricks. ...
<randell>	madodel, take my word, you really don't want to creat IPF code unless you really need to...
<PeterSkye>	... I need to write them down, and then I need a way to find them.
<PeterSkye>	... If INF/HLP isn't the answer, what is?
<randell>	Ok... I don't see any benefit from INF/HLP in that case...
<madodel>	randell: I know, I wish I didn't have to create it myself
<SteveS>	I suggest using EPM or E or your favorite text editor and create a text file of the info you want to remember.
<PeterSkye>	I really need my _own_ Help Desk software, so I can "manage myself". :)
<maverick>	I have a SS with lots of layers, how can I "easily" run one script in any layer w/o scrolling to it?
<madodel>	The advantage of creating an INF file, would be that you can search for things from help
<randell>	Peter, I'm not advocating it as a solution, but explain to me what would *not* work with just plain searchable text? That might explain what kind of tool you really need.
<PeterSkye>	SteveS - I write _very_ large "help" files. You _know_ I'm prolific with words. :)))
<randell>	maverick, there are several choice for running scripts...
<madodel>	he ain't kidding on that score
<PeterSkye>	Randell - For example: My own home page is about 850 KB of text. I can search it, but the info is ...
<PeterSkye>	scattered from the beginning to the end. I need some kind of search engine ...
<randell>	maverick, first there is the script toolbar that should be appearing down the right side (by default)... just click the correct button...
<PeterSkye>	... that will summarize the possible "hits", just as a HLP/INF search does.
<Swanee>	PeterSkye: You can write an ipf file and compile it with the ipfc compiler but then the question arises... do you set up an icon to "View" "PetersMesa.hlp" or maybe go the route StevenL suggested... I haven't tried this on a standard program hlp file but you can set an environment variable to open hlp files together if Randell/Rollin can give you the environment variable to work with. (set mesabook=mesa.hlp+petersmesa.hlp)
<randell>	second, there is a menu command (which could also be assigned to a toolbar button) that lets you pick and execute a script from a list...
<SteveS>	To search for data in a text file, use EPM or E and use the "Find" function. It find key words for you quickly, even in very large files.
<randell>	and third you can assign keyboard shortcuts to run scripts (using the selection manager when you have that script in focus)
<StevenL>	It would be easy to add your own help items to the Mesa menu.
<PeterSkye>	... And I might have some of the info posted on my Home Page, some in SkMesa.txt (I have such a file), ...
<PeterSkye>	... some in QuadLines.txt, some in FP.txt (both are part of my Financial files), etc.
<PeterSkye>	... If I'm going to centralize a lot of my calcs and graphics around Mesa 2 and rely on its ...
<StevenL>	Peter, it sounds like you want a generalized text indexing system.
<PeterSkye>	features, I need some kind of Help Desk management.
<randell>	Peter, sounds like you definitely do!
<maverick>	Randell, thanks again, the kbd shortcut sounds like what I need.
<PeterSkye>	StevenL: Yes, and I've done some development towards that. (Ask me about ALIGNIT offline ...)
<Timka>	maverick: you can also use RUNSCRIPT function in any cell/layer to run script by it's name
<SteveS>	We all know what Peter really needs. I have the spit ready to use on the BBQ!
<randell>	maverick, good... if it's not obvious how to do it, let me know.
<randell>	Peter, I guess I'd go out on a limb and suggest you set up a private web server... and then invest in some
<StevenL>	Randell, you might mention that the script names show up on the status line as you pass over the icons.
<warspite>	Randell, is there a kbd shortcut for changing spreadsheet layers, given that I've already used the Enter >down and Tab Enter > Right keys?
<randell>	kind of web site search engine (like Altavista or whatever engine you prefer) to search it.
<Timka>	warspite: Alt+PgDn/PgUp
<warspite>	Thanks again, Timka.
<randell>	warsprite, I don't know off the top of my head... but I think Timka is correct.
<Timka>	these combination are most used by me ;)
<Iceman>	wilh layers, is the a way to insert a page between two others, or shift the order of the layers around (move them similar to rows & columns)?
<randell>	Iceman, you can insert a layer...
<rollin>	Right clicking on the tabs will let you insert a layer. Currently, you can't reorder layers.
<randell>	try the popup menu on the layer selectors
<StevenL>	Reording the layers is possible...
<StevenL>	It takes a couple of steps.
<rollin>	True :)
<randell>	StevenL, but its not "automatic" and one step... we've had requests for it and I know it's on the future "wish list"
<StevenL>	I would like it too. :)
<StevenL>	The current way is cumbersome.
<Iceman>	stevenl, how would you reorder - cut and paste?
<randell>	I forget why it's technically a bit difficult for us to implement... but that's the reason it hasn't shown up yet.
<StevenL>	I've also got a wish for labels to be equivalent to cell numbers.
<Timka>	randell: how abou D&D layers by RMB?
<randell>	StevenL, please explain that last one.
<StevenL>	OK, Mesa treats labels and cell names as distict items...
<randell>	Timka, it's an internal issue... not a UI issue... drag and drop is definitely one way I'd want the user to be able to do it.
<StevenL>	The result is that you cannot use them interchagably....
<StevenL>	Things get broken.
<randell>	StevenL, maybe I'm being dense but what do you mean by "cell name" in that context
<StevenL>	OK let's say I assign the label TotalSales to cell B5...
<randell>	Ok...
<StevenL>	There are cases where changes to the sheet breaks this connection...
<randell>	Is B5 the "cell name" as far as you are concerned?
<randell>	Ah!
<StevenL>	Yes. That's probably not the term you use. I'd had to go read the manual again.
<StevenL>	Mesa is not alone in this...
<StevenL>	Some spreadsheets handle it the way I prefer...
<randell>	Keep in mind that a label really refers to a *range*, not a single cell -- you are using it in the degenerate case (which is ok).
<StevenL>	That is the Label is just and alias for a cell name or a cell range...
<StevenL>	I can break it either way. I was just using a simple case.
<randell>	So the issue is when you take some action that moves B5 to some other location in the sheet?
<StevenL>	Yes.
<randell>	I know we've had an internal discusion about this... but don't recall the exact outcome.
<StevenL>	It requires internal changes to Mesa...
<randell>	Basically, we are currently trying to make it as consistent in the treatment of this as other spreadsheets as possible...
<StevenL>	Currently the formulas contain the labels, if they were entered that way.
<randell>	But I think we were talking about an option that would let you "lock down" the connection tighter... Dan would know for sure.
<StevenL>	One easy wishlist item is for the Label to show in the status line when the selection matches the label.
<randell>	Yes, that's correct... particularly since labeled ranges can automatically "grow"
<StevenL>	As they should.
<randell>	I'll have to think about that one...
<StevenL>	OK.
<StevenL>	Another related wishlist item is a method to convert formulas from labeled to unlabel and back.
<randell>	More questions (or did I mange not to answer some when we were dealing with Peter's documentation thing)?
<Iceman>	randell, will any work be done on incorporating a solver (such as the frontsys.com one in the big 3 SS) into mesa?
<randell>	StevenL, Ok... I don't recall it being on the list but we can add that one if it's not.
<StevenL>	I'm not sure I every distinctly requested it. :)
<randell>	We've looked at the solver issue...
<Swanee>	Hi Chip
<Chip>	Hi everybody
<randell>	But Dan hasn't come up with a plan he's entirely happy with... and I don't want us to do it until we can do it right.
<Iceman>	randell, is it more of a cost/demand issue?
<randell>	So at this point a solver is still a "longer term" thing...
<StevenL>	Randell, anything on the list for auditing sheets?
<randell>	Iceman, that's certainly part of it... but it's really more an issue of making sure it all fits well within the Mesa architecture.
<Iceman>	it sure would be nice because right now i always have to export to excel, solve, then import back.
<StevenL>	Iceman, I haven't tried it, but you might be able to simulate some solvers with a little mesascript.
<randell>	Iceman, have you mentioned that to Dan at all? He might have some ideas depending on exactly what kind of solving you are doing.
<randell>	StevenL, I'd have to defer that one (auditing sheets) to Dan.
<Iceman>	yeah, i had mentioned it to dan, it's mostly non-linear systems of equations which need to be simultaneously solved.
<randell>	Iceman, I know I can't help with that one...
<Iceman>	i know that a company with numerical recipes (www.nr.com) hass C code for solving, maybe i'll look into it and see if i can use scripting with the code?
<randell>	Iceman, that would work....
<StevenL>	Iceman, are your systems big enough to use something like Octave?
<randell>	You could either redo the C code in REXX (not recommended) and take a hit on the performance... and call the C code more directly (perhaps from an add-in function).
<Iceman>	i had tried octave, but i never really figured it out, but the nr looks promising because i think they also have dll files to call up, so it might be easier to use.
<StevenL>	Possibly, if the data export/import is not too painful.
<randell>	Data volume will definitely be the gating factor in how well it will work
<randell>	Before we head toward a wrapup for the evening...
<randell>	I should mention that we will be domonstrating Version 2.3 of Mesa 2 at WarpTech...
<randell>	And we'll be featuring Mesa 2 in some of our presentations there.
<randell>	Rollin, perhaps you'd like to comment on that a little.
<rollin>	You bet. I'll be doing two presentations.
<mandie>	do we have anyone here that will be attending warptech...besides the obvious?
<rollin>	One will be a detailed session on the Mesa feed capabilities. The other will be on integrating applications together using REXX.
<StevenL>	Me.
<Swanee>	yo
<mandie>	great!
<DaveWm>	maybe
<SteveS>	Yes I will be attending WarpTech.
<Swanee>	I'll expect to see you there Dave :-)
<rollin>	Let me correct myself...
<DaveWm>	lookin forward
<Swanee>	:-)
<rollin>	The second presentation will not be on connecting applications, it will be on Mesa macros and MScripts.
<DaveWm>	demo'ing junk spy??
<rollin>	We'll be showing JS in our booth in the exhibit area.
<randell>	While our planned availability for Version 2.3 of Mesa 2 isn't until June.. we definitely hope to have it available for WarpTech.
<DaveWm>	the technology should be of interest to many of the participants
<warspite>	Randell, just slipped off quietly and sent that errant file to you.
<randell>	The code is looking good and the docs are on schedule but we haven't frozen things quite yet...
<randell>	warpspite, thanks... I'll try to look at it on Tuesday.
<madodel>	randell: any other Sundial apps expecting updates in the near future?
<DavidA>	Randell: any projection for Relish 2.3 yet?
<StevenL>	:)
<randell>	Somebody *would* have to ask... ;)
<StevenL>	Wonder why?
<randell>	Don't have the date yet... but there are *lots* of things checked off on the features list...
<warspite>	Any news on Clearlook or DBExpert?
<randell>	I'm still trying to decide about a couple of "big things" for Relish (based on feedback) so that's adding to the time a bit...
<randell>	DBExpert 2.0.9 should be out shortly -- it's primarily a "bug fix" release. We hope to have it before WarpTech as well.
<randell>	Nobody has asked about the *price* of those Mesa 2.3 upgrades you all are going to want...
<PeterSkye>	Don't care. I just _want_ it.
<maverick>	I'll bite, how much?
<rollin>	Peter gets his own price.
<Swanee>	hehe
<rollin>	At least 10 times as much as everyone else.
<PeterSkye>	Yaah! $20 extra!
<randell>	Except for Peter (who will pay *lots* extra), if you have a license for 2.2, you can download the 2.3 product at no extra charge!
<PeterSkye>	I need an MScript that checks your PMMail time zone ...
<maverick>	coolllll....
<warspite>	You beauty!
<StevenL>	Peter, you can do that.
<SteveS>	The documentation is extra for Peter.
<randell>	(There will be a small charge if you need diskettes or want the printed 2.3 supplement that replaces the 2.2 supplment.)
<StevenL>	Charge him for each lost copy.
<randell>	Yes, it *still* fits on 2 diskettes!
<PeterSkye>	StevenL - that'll be a weekly charge!
<StevenL>	Yep.
<randell>	Any last comments/questions before we're out of here until our next visit in June (with a report from WarpTech)?
<Swanee>	Just a "thank you" from me
<warspite>	Maybe I missed it, anything happening with Clearlook?
<StevenL>	Thanks from me too.
<randell>	I don't have anything to add on status of the Clearlook 2.0 release at this time... sorry.
<warspite>	Not a problem, and thanks for everything...can't wait 'till June.
<Iceman>	best wishes and keep up the good work, you guys make the best software on any platform!
<randell>	Thanks again for having us... and I apologize for any confusion that might have come about from our last-minute rescheduling earlier in April.
<PeterSkye>	Thanks Randell, Rollin. :)
<randell>	Iceman, can we quote that?
<Iceman>	absolutely, but don't let M$ hear that...
<randell>	And we all will need to kick Dan for not getting here tonight!
<maverick>	Thanks, my first time on IRC, very informative, very interesting...:-)
<PeterSkye>	Maverick-Guitarman, come by more often. :)
<maverick>	I will!
<Swanee>	Glad to have you tonight maverick. Hope we will see you again. :-)
<Swanee>	Hi DAVE
<DAVE>	hello Swanee, 1maxson, Timka how are you
<madodel>	Good Night all, and feel free to stop by #voice #os/2 or #scoug any time
<randell>	Night folks... dinner's waiting so I gotta run...
<StevenL>	Bye.
<rollin>	Thanks again, and as always, feel free to drop us email for feature requests, suggestions, etc.
<Swanee>	Good night randell, rollin and madodel?
<Sector>	Goodnight madodel
<DaveWm>	thanks for coming by
<Sector>	Bye randell
<madodel>	Also if anyone has any ideas for future speakups, please send them to editor@os2voice.org
<randell>	bye sector
<randell>	And if you have topics you'd like us to cover in out bi-monthly Sundial speakup, please let VOICE or us know as well.
<randell>	You can always reach us on the web at www.sundialsystems.com (unless another *** cuts our DSL cable again)!